Avoid Playa Del Sol Time Share
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If you are going to Puerto Vallarta you will eventually be approached to attend a timeshare presentation and sales pitch. DON'T DO IT. SAY NO AND MEAN IT. WALK AWAY. You will be offered numerous incentives to attend and if you go you will be subjected to an hours long sales pitch that is high pressure, unending and so convincing that it would sell ice cubes to Eskimoes. If you buy you will find that most of what you have been told are lies and exaggerations. You will sign a one sided contract that obligates you to pay, and pay, and pay and pay...while they can unilaterally change the terms to which they agreed, not deliver the services promised, raise and insert new fees that go up each year and deny you use of your weeks when and where you want to use them: the availability of rooms will frequently not coincide with when you want to vacation. Especially be aware of the Play Del Sol Group. Run , do not walk to avoid this organization.
Pull A Ben Johnson
Good advice gonzzo and welcome aboard . 
I will never understand the advantages of timeshares but a few will shortly chime in and set the record straight . 
I will never understand the advantages of timeshares but a few will shortly chime in and set the record straight . Last edited by smitty on Fri Mar 27, 2009 6:55 am, edited 1 time in total.
I would just like to point out that men the world over do not like to do any work when there's drinking to be done, and that includes Eskimos, so rather than go out and chip the ice, clean the yellow parts off, and bag it, most northern snow dwellers prefer buying their ice as well!it would sell ice cubes to Eskimoes
Don't have, don't want a timeshare. Not worth my time or aggravation to do a presentation.. Was offered $ 800 this past January while downtown.
If you are going to buy you have to do your homework first. Buying on the spur of the moment while you are caught up in the relaxation of vacation mode is not the time to jump in with both feet. I love mine and I have never regretted buying it, but I had been going to that resort for 5 years before I ever purchased there. I bought one week as an aftersale and then the next week I purchased I linked to the week I already had. I went into the sales office with a plan in mind and I told them what I wanted, no presentation for me, I just walked right into the sales office and said I want to know what kind of deal you can give me for another week, linked to the one I already own, with both under a premier membership. It took me about 1-1/2 hrs from start to finish and I had exactly what I wanted for the price I wanted. I not only own in PV but in Nuevo, Cabo, and soon to be finished Cancun and Loreto Mexico. I can go to any one of the resorts that I want to. The club that runs them is located about 80 miles from my home in Cali. so any problems I can handle them right in my own backyard. But you have to know what you are buying before signing on the dotted line. I have taken a minimum of two weeks vacation, and up to six weeks, for the past 20 years, not only in PV but in Hawaii (4 times), skiing (2 times) and the rest of the time I come back to the city that has stolen my heart, PV. It's not for everyone, but it certainly has worked for me. Now that there are so many resales, if you do your homework you can get some really good deals for unbelievably low prices.
Time Shares a SCAM? OH MY GOD !
Wow, I can't believe it!
Seriously thou, If you fell for the bull don't rant and rave here. Those guys get paid to lie to you and are very good at there job. If you think you can buy a week in the low season and trade it for a week in the high season it ain't gonna happen. If you think your getting some amazing deal, and 3 or 400.00, or a blanket and a bottle of tequila, and a car /Jeep rental, but it's only good till 5:00 today, give your head a shake. Lots of people got hit the same way myself included, make the best of what you got or trade, sell, for what you can use. google the" time share users group" (TUG) I used them to trade off my time share and get one that I could live with and I was happy with it for many years.
Yeah, it hurts but thats what booze and sun does to you.
Seriously thou, If you fell for the bull don't rant and rave here. Those guys get paid to lie to you and are very good at there job. If you think you can buy a week in the low season and trade it for a week in the high season it ain't gonna happen. If you think your getting some amazing deal, and 3 or 400.00, or a blanket and a bottle of tequila, and a car /Jeep rental, but it's only good till 5:00 today, give your head a shake. Lots of people got hit the same way myself included, make the best of what you got or trade, sell, for what you can use. google the" time share users group" (TUG) I used them to trade off my time share and get one that I could live with and I was happy with it for many years.
Yeah, it hurts but thats what booze and sun does to you.
Scam Shares
Kat - I know your TS has worked out for you - good for you . The TS biz kind of reminds me of what is happening in the US housing market now . People get conned into believing they can afford more then they can - reality sets in - then the Vultures are circling - no worries - great deals on resales/ foreclosures .
Johnathan Gibbs has written (March 2009) a very good article explaining timeshares...
An interview with Jonathan Gibbs on Timeshares. Jonathan Gibbs Timeshare Consult has been helping people get out of unwanted Timeshares, Timeshare Mortgages and campground contracts since2005. Jonathan Gibbs’ experience in accessing an accurate climate for timeshare sales, maintenance fees and the future of the industry is unparallel; coming from personal interaction with thousands of timeshare owners face-to-face in more than 30 different states over the last few years. Jonathan Gibbs refers to his time with thousands of timeshare owners as a detailed market survey so accurate, he is confident that he can forecast specific market details in this industry for the next 5 years including; total sales, resale pricing and even the specific maintenance fee increase for a 1000 different resorts in the United States. “This is not simply a survey of a few hundred owners in a few well know destinations. We have been tracking maintenance fee escalations for 5 years, assessments and the decline in resale pricing on more than 1000 different properties over a 5 year period,” reports Jonathan Gibbs.
Jonathan explains that the biggest problem is the nature of the fee simple interest style of ownership which most timeshares are deeded as. “The deed is not the same as the deeds we own our homes with. We do not “own” the timeshare the same way. In most cases, even if a person owned 52 weeks at the same resort, they still would not be able to paint the condo unit, change the furniture or any permanent fixtures attached to the outside or inside of the properties. The “rights” that the timeshare owner has is basically the right to “use” the property during a specific interval of time. Even when the mortgage is paid off, there is still no intrinsic value to those rights since the timeshare owner must continue to pay annual fees for usage whether the unit is used or not. This explains why if a timeshare owner with no mortgage tried to get a “home equity” loan on a $30,000 timeshare, the bank won’t not even grant them a $500 loan. That’s because the ownership (deeded though it may be) has no value to the bank, or banking world for that matter. A bank will loan the developer money against their interest in the resort, because the developer has a different type of ownership,” explained Jonathan Gibbs. Jonathan went onto give specific examples of timeshare resorts which were sold by the developers, the developers made a nice profit on the increased value of the physical real estate but the “timeshare owners” received nothing. In several of Jonathan’s recent examples, the timeshare owners had their interest (and yearly maintenance fee obligation) transferred to another resort. Thus leaving the developers with profit from their 10 year ownership and the timeshare owner with a cash loss from their original purchase and now a liability position as the responsible owner of another annual maintenance fee contract.
Bottom line, the only value to a timeshare is how much someone is willing to pay to use it. As long as the maintenance fees are low, the ownership may have some marketable value. This value has to be compared with the cost of staying in equal accommodations. For example: 10 years ago, if the maintenance fee for a Hawaii 2 bedroom timeshare was $200 per year and the cost of renting a room of equal amenities was $100/night there would be a $500 value per year (if used every single year) to the property. Still not worth a $15,000 sales price as it would take more than 30 years to break even if the maintenance fees never went up. Here’s the problem. Today the fees to that property are $900 for the week, (again, whether it’s used or not), and the cost to renting out a similar unit through the many modern day options online can range from $50-200 /night. This leaves no value in the ownership since the small benefit of savings, IF there is one, can be easily outweighed by a missed usage year or a mandatory assessment for repairs that must be paid by the timeshare owner.
Now you have a situation where there is no commercial value to the banking community, no consumer value to the retail community, only perceived value by many of the owners.
“There is a huge void between the reality of timeshare ownership and today’s’ market place,” reports Jonathan Gibbs. “Because of the extreme often brain washing “hard sell” of the Timeshare Sales pitch over the years and the grossly inflated sales prices,” owners have been convinced to adopt the idea of an inflated value in order to justify the huge expense that was most often paid off slowing over 7-10 years at 18% interest. Only later, when the timeshare owner tries to sell the property do they end up discovering the truth of their purchase. It’s original value was a fraction of what they spent, and it’s current value may be less than zero.
What does the future hold? Unless the developers begin to lower the annual dues, which is highly unlikely, the industry is headed for massive meltdown. Of course, as usual the timeshare owners will be left holding the bag.
For more information on timeshare value we recommend this ABC video with Financial Advisor Dave Ramsey and Timeshare Market Analysis www.timeshareresalesreport.com .
http://www.1888pressrelease.com/jonatha ... 03751.html
An interview with Jonathan Gibbs on Timeshares. Jonathan Gibbs Timeshare Consult has been helping people get out of unwanted Timeshares, Timeshare Mortgages and campground contracts since2005. Jonathan Gibbs’ experience in accessing an accurate climate for timeshare sales, maintenance fees and the future of the industry is unparallel; coming from personal interaction with thousands of timeshare owners face-to-face in more than 30 different states over the last few years. Jonathan Gibbs refers to his time with thousands of timeshare owners as a detailed market survey so accurate, he is confident that he can forecast specific market details in this industry for the next 5 years including; total sales, resale pricing and even the specific maintenance fee increase for a 1000 different resorts in the United States. “This is not simply a survey of a few hundred owners in a few well know destinations. We have been tracking maintenance fee escalations for 5 years, assessments and the decline in resale pricing on more than 1000 different properties over a 5 year period,” reports Jonathan Gibbs.
Jonathan explains that the biggest problem is the nature of the fee simple interest style of ownership which most timeshares are deeded as. “The deed is not the same as the deeds we own our homes with. We do not “own” the timeshare the same way. In most cases, even if a person owned 52 weeks at the same resort, they still would not be able to paint the condo unit, change the furniture or any permanent fixtures attached to the outside or inside of the properties. The “rights” that the timeshare owner has is basically the right to “use” the property during a specific interval of time. Even when the mortgage is paid off, there is still no intrinsic value to those rights since the timeshare owner must continue to pay annual fees for usage whether the unit is used or not. This explains why if a timeshare owner with no mortgage tried to get a “home equity” loan on a $30,000 timeshare, the bank won’t not even grant them a $500 loan. That’s because the ownership (deeded though it may be) has no value to the bank, or banking world for that matter. A bank will loan the developer money against their interest in the resort, because the developer has a different type of ownership,” explained Jonathan Gibbs. Jonathan went onto give specific examples of timeshare resorts which were sold by the developers, the developers made a nice profit on the increased value of the physical real estate but the “timeshare owners” received nothing. In several of Jonathan’s recent examples, the timeshare owners had their interest (and yearly maintenance fee obligation) transferred to another resort. Thus leaving the developers with profit from their 10 year ownership and the timeshare owner with a cash loss from their original purchase and now a liability position as the responsible owner of another annual maintenance fee contract.
Bottom line, the only value to a timeshare is how much someone is willing to pay to use it. As long as the maintenance fees are low, the ownership may have some marketable value. This value has to be compared with the cost of staying in equal accommodations. For example: 10 years ago, if the maintenance fee for a Hawaii 2 bedroom timeshare was $200 per year and the cost of renting a room of equal amenities was $100/night there would be a $500 value per year (if used every single year) to the property. Still not worth a $15,000 sales price as it would take more than 30 years to break even if the maintenance fees never went up. Here’s the problem. Today the fees to that property are $900 for the week, (again, whether it’s used or not), and the cost to renting out a similar unit through the many modern day options online can range from $50-200 /night. This leaves no value in the ownership since the small benefit of savings, IF there is one, can be easily outweighed by a missed usage year or a mandatory assessment for repairs that must be paid by the timeshare owner.
Now you have a situation where there is no commercial value to the banking community, no consumer value to the retail community, only perceived value by many of the owners.
“There is a huge void between the reality of timeshare ownership and today’s’ market place,” reports Jonathan Gibbs. “Because of the extreme often brain washing “hard sell” of the Timeshare Sales pitch over the years and the grossly inflated sales prices,” owners have been convinced to adopt the idea of an inflated value in order to justify the huge expense that was most often paid off slowing over 7-10 years at 18% interest. Only later, when the timeshare owner tries to sell the property do they end up discovering the truth of their purchase. It’s original value was a fraction of what they spent, and it’s current value may be less than zero.
What does the future hold? Unless the developers begin to lower the annual dues, which is highly unlikely, the industry is headed for massive meltdown. Of course, as usual the timeshare owners will be left holding the bag.
For more information on timeshare value we recommend this ABC video with Financial Advisor Dave Ramsey and Timeshare Market Analysis www.timeshareresalesreport.com .
http://www.1888pressrelease.com/jonatha ... 03751.html
Smitty,
That is why I said you have to do your homework. I had been going to that resort for 5 years before I bought there. My maintenence fees have gone up but nothing overhwelming over the 15 years I have owned there. Once you know the ins and outs of how a resort works, it can and does work to your advantage. I can stay in PV for a month for $1300 or $325 a week/$46.50 a day. Not taking a package deal just straight room costs. I can trade out two weeks of that time and stay in Hawaii with the exchange fee for approximately $75.00 a night. The resorts I say at are nice 4 and 5 star resorts.
There are several things that factor in when you are considering if it is worth the cost to you.
#1 The type of accomodations you are accustomed to staying in/or want to stay in.
#2 The trade value if you want to trade out to another location. Hawaii is the #1 requested destination, Mexico is #2. Owning at one of the top travel destinations gives you a big advantage in trading out....you have a location and a resort that others want to trade into and thus pretty much guarantee the exchange company that room is not going to sit unused in their inventory so you go to the top of the list for preference on exchange availability.
#3 The cost of your maintenence fees, I would never buy in Hawaii, their maintenence fees are ridiculous simply because of the cost of living in the islands. Mexico pays much lower wages to people to do their maintenence work.
#4 The time of year you own, also affects the trading value.
So knowing the industry and how it works is a must in order to get it to work to your benefit. Buying a fixed week at the worst time of the year is going to get you burned, you aren't going to want to go there and neither is anyone else so trading for another location is harder. Renting it out is next to impossible.
There have been people I know who have bought re-sales at some of the nicest resorts in PV for as little as $100.00 on e-bay. So you pay $100.00 plus the title transfer costs, etc. it comes out to around a one time investment of approximately $500/600. My maintenece fees on my 1 bedroom unit are approximtely $500 a year ( I knew this resort kept the maintenece fees low before I bought there) I own it on a 30 year lease, my sons are on the title with me so if something happens to me, it is theirs to use until they decide they don't want it anymore or until the lease runs out with no hassles of title change, etc.
As I said, it is not for everyone, but it sure has worked for me. I have had some great vacations at a very resonable cost for the past 15 years and I don't regret buying it. It forces me to take a vacation where I might otherwise just stay home or not take any time off of work.
That is why I said you have to do your homework. I had been going to that resort for 5 years before I bought there. My maintenence fees have gone up but nothing overhwelming over the 15 years I have owned there. Once you know the ins and outs of how a resort works, it can and does work to your advantage. I can stay in PV for a month for $1300 or $325 a week/$46.50 a day. Not taking a package deal just straight room costs. I can trade out two weeks of that time and stay in Hawaii with the exchange fee for approximately $75.00 a night. The resorts I say at are nice 4 and 5 star resorts.
There are several things that factor in when you are considering if it is worth the cost to you.
#1 The type of accomodations you are accustomed to staying in/or want to stay in.
#2 The trade value if you want to trade out to another location. Hawaii is the #1 requested destination, Mexico is #2. Owning at one of the top travel destinations gives you a big advantage in trading out....you have a location and a resort that others want to trade into and thus pretty much guarantee the exchange company that room is not going to sit unused in their inventory so you go to the top of the list for preference on exchange availability.
#3 The cost of your maintenence fees, I would never buy in Hawaii, their maintenence fees are ridiculous simply because of the cost of living in the islands. Mexico pays much lower wages to people to do their maintenence work.
#4 The time of year you own, also affects the trading value.
So knowing the industry and how it works is a must in order to get it to work to your benefit. Buying a fixed week at the worst time of the year is going to get you burned, you aren't going to want to go there and neither is anyone else so trading for another location is harder. Renting it out is next to impossible.
There have been people I know who have bought re-sales at some of the nicest resorts in PV for as little as $100.00 on e-bay. So you pay $100.00 plus the title transfer costs, etc. it comes out to around a one time investment of approximately $500/600. My maintenece fees on my 1 bedroom unit are approximtely $500 a year ( I knew this resort kept the maintenece fees low before I bought there) I own it on a 30 year lease, my sons are on the title with me so if something happens to me, it is theirs to use until they decide they don't want it anymore or until the lease runs out with no hassles of title change, etc.
As I said, it is not for everyone, but it sure has worked for me. I have had some great vacations at a very resonable cost for the past 15 years and I don't regret buying it. It forces me to take a vacation where I might otherwise just stay home or not take any time off of work.
If you find that after you have used your time share for a number of years you no longer feel it is a good deal because the maintainence fees have gone through the roof you can simply give it back or stop paying the yearly fees and they will take it back. This is what we did after 15 years of our 25 year time share. Unless it is a fractional time share and your time is prime you are going to have a hard time reselling. A friend just bought a life time time share 3 bedroom, 2 weeks at Christmas outside Disney world off EBay for $9.95 plus transfer fees $295.00 total ($300.00 per week maintainence fee). I could not give away our 4 bedroom unit, 2 weeks in Nov. at Los Tules, which we bought on TUG 10 years ago for $1000.00 per week, because of the high maintainence costs, .
Please note that never once did I say to go to a presentation and/or purchase that way. You will just waste hours of your vacation time, probably end up getting insulted, your blood pessure with be twice as high as when you walked into the place and you will usually end up paying more than you should have. I stay away from presentations like they are the plague. The last one I went to...... I went to do a very good OPC friend of mine a favor. Once all the insults started; "admit it you just came for the gift and if you didn't give it to me and I will donate it to charity, etc." I wanted to stand up and say "No I came to do a friend a favor," but I knew if I did he probably would not get his commission. Soooooo, I stood up in the middle of the sales room and in a VERY LOUD voice I said, I didn't come here to be insulted, I don't have to stand here and take this and I saw that Mr. So and So, the developer, was outside when I came in and since I know him personally (not a lie) I am sure he will want to know how you are treating his potential investors. That's how you get out of a presentation in a hurry, they could not get me out of that room fast enough. as I was getting in the taxi they assured me the guy had been fired and just escorted off the property. I am not sure that was totally true but he was a real jerk and if he got fired he deserved it. Who needs that on vacation!
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Early Times
- PV Beachbum
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- Joined:Tue Feb 24, 2009 7:10 pm
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spaceguy51
- PV Beachbum
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- Joined:Fri Jun 11, 2010 12:40 pm
- Location:La Paz, BCS, Mexico
Time Share
Couldn't agree more. One tactic you can use to get rid of these people, permanently. Tell them you don't have any credit cards. It worked for me.
